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Post by Rob W on Jan 24, 2015 13:01:06 GMT
Having had the pleasure of creating the 'Greatest Hits - 2014' web page, I had an idea. Some of the songs that didn't win could, perhaps, have been improved with some collaboration. So my proposal for March is as follows.
1. We all find a song (NOT a winning song) by another songwriter from the April - December 2014 selection.
2. Once you have decided on the song, you record your version of it. It's sort of a 'covers' month except that the new version can have new lyrics (or part new lyrics) and new sections (middle 8s etc) or variations on sections.
3. It must be recognisable as the song you're covering (i.e. the basic melody should be the same.)
4. In the spirit of collaboration, you can request that other people (including the original writer) offer their musical input (but it's not compulsory) and if you've been asked and don't want to be involved, you're under no obligation.
It's not too late to change this one or scrap it, so I'll absolutely listen to the views of everyone.
Let me know your thoughts.
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Post by timwarner on Jan 24, 2015 19:54:57 GMT
The main problem, as I see it, is revisiting and selecting a song from the range that has gone before.
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Post by timwarner on Jan 25, 2015 15:58:33 GMT
Just been looking at some of the previous songs and some have lyrics on the page. That may be helpful. Can anyone else remember what their lyrics were?
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Post by eddiecustard on Jan 26, 2015 1:27:52 GMT
Sorry to be a wet blanket Rob, but I wonder if it's a bit tricky logistically.
Patrick had an idea that you put us in pairs and we each have to send our partner a lyric to put to music. In other words, every song will be a collaboration from within the group, and each of us will be involved in two songs (one where we have written the music and the other where we have written the lyrics). You'd just have to send us the email address of the partner that you have allocated to us, so we can send them a lyric. We can't vote for either of the two songs we have co-written. What do you reckon?
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Post by stephen on Jan 26, 2015 10:49:03 GMT
I like both of these ideas - one person does the lyrics, the other the music. It hasn't done Bernie and Elton any harm. You could do it in either order - up to the pair concerned. Can we choose whether we're lyrics or music?
I would also be delighted if someone took one of my old songs, which have all been recorded in a cupboard using techniques from either the 1930s or the 1980s, and made a decent production job of it, using new instruments or whatever they wanted to do.
And I'd be delighted to record someone else's songs in a cupboard, etc., even if they might not be over-pleased with the result. I would need the chords, though.
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Post by eddiecustard on Jan 26, 2015 13:57:25 GMT
I wasn't really thinking of it as an either/or. The idea is that each of us writes a lyric and gives it to our partner to do the music. That way we'll all have two co-written songs, one where we've only done the music and one where we've only done the lyrics. But the workload and the number of songs for the month will be the same as normal.
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Post by Rob W on Jan 26, 2015 15:28:39 GMT
Interesting. Just to be clear, when you say 'music' do you mean chords and melody? (In other words, would the 'music' person need to provide a 'hummed' melody for the lyricist or would the lyricist just work independently and provide the music provider with a set of lyrics and say 'here you go, write some music!')
The 'pairing' process would be interesting! And the only down-side I can see is if one member of a pairing is hard-pushed to produce anything that month due to life getting in the way.
I'm completely open to the idea (and still like my original idea so Stephen's either/or idea may be a goer.)
Any more suggestions/opinions?
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Post by eddiecustard on Jan 26, 2015 15:47:32 GMT
You'd simply send a set of lyrics to your allocated partner and they would write and record the song. If it happens in both directions you'll have two co-written songs by the same pair. But you'll be doing the same amount of work as normal.
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Post by mikegosling on Jan 26, 2015 17:05:55 GMT
I prefer the collaboration idea from Eddie. Just my normal preference for writing something new rather than covering songs. Also, would be fun to collaborate with someone I've never met!
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Post by timwarner on Jan 26, 2015 23:57:27 GMT
From the last few comments the lyrics seem to be most people's starting point. It's not that way for me. The prospect of writing lyrics with no tune to fit them too is, well, terrifying. I suppose that may be the point though. I never seem to etch tune or lyrics in stone until I actually record them.
If we do the team-up thing, can I be paired with someone who can sing?
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Post by Rob W on Jan 27, 2015 9:38:28 GMT
Tim and I share the same concerns/terror! But as he said, perhaps '...that may be the point...'
In a spare moment, I will see who we have 'active' and see how the pairings may work. Watch this space OR if anyone wants to put forward an initial pairing list, please be my guest.
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Post by Rob W on Jan 27, 2015 9:58:43 GMT
I couldn't resist!
I just had a quick go.
I divided 10 members who appear to be relatively active into two groups of five and (awkward!) divided them along 'confident singers/less confident singers' lines!! I thought that a good rule should be that we shouldn't personally know the person with whom we'd be writing with and so some pairings leapt out. The solutions begin to sound like a question in an 11plus exam!! ('Rob can't be paired with Tim, Mike, Colin S or Phil...etc etc')
My first go is as follows
Rob W (me) and Colin P
Tim & Glyn and Phil
Eddie and Tim & Julie
Patrick and Colin S
Stephen C and Mike
The trouble is that as soon as you make a list, there's the danger that someone on that list may say 'Hang on a minute, I was hoping for...' and then it all starts to get a bit awkward!!
Also, Rob G is not on the list and he has already uploaded for 'Love' month so could be active for March also.
Is this a can of worms or what?
If I had to vote on either/or, I'd go back to the original 'improver' idea of taking an already written song and trying to create a new version but I definitely appear to be in the minority so I'm happy to try the pairing system.
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Post by mikegosling on Jan 27, 2015 12:16:25 GMT
The pairings look good - though the singer aspect doesn't matter as we are
all going to sing the songs where we've written the music, aren't we?
Like Rob and Tim, I usually write (most of) the lyrics after the melody/music is
written. However, when I have set lyrics (or poems) to music I do find
that the lyrics often have a greater integrity to them.
Also, Rob G could work with Colin S (as he has in previous entries last year).
I look forward to collaborating with Stephen.
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Post by Rob W on Jan 27, 2015 12:46:25 GMT
Good point (re 'all...to sing the songs..')
I look forward to hearing any other opinions and then we can sign this one off!
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Post by colinallcars on Jan 27, 2015 21:32:55 GMT
Happy to write some lyrics and write a tune for someone (Rob W) else's. Could be fun.....
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Post by timwarner on Jan 28, 2015 8:00:42 GMT
I guess the point of the SWC is to push us out of our comfort zones so, for me at least, writing words first is a bit of a challenge.Then there is the pressure of not making a pig's ear of Eddie's lyrics. Good challenge and I've very happy to be paired with Eddie.
Having just spoken to Julie, she says she likes writing the words first. This surprised me quite a bit because she normally gets the lyrics done about 10 minutes before the deadline.
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Post by Colin Steward on Mar 2, 2015 16:39:43 GMT
So, is the final decision the pairings or improvers?
It's not without some trepidation on my part because whilst a pairing with Patrick kind of ensures a pretty good entry (and I'll learn a lot), I also feel a little sorry for Patrick!!
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Post by Patrick on Mar 3, 2015 20:41:09 GMT
Colin - what's your email I've got some lyrics for you if you fancy
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Post by mikegosling on Mar 3, 2015 20:57:11 GMT
Message for Stephen - looking forward to collaborating this month.
My email is MichaelJGosling@aol.com
Please can you let me know your email.
Cheers, Mike
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Post by Colin Steward on Mar 3, 2015 21:35:03 GMT
Patrick, I'll give you my iPad email which is less cluttered. Colfungus@gmail.com
I'll try not to destroy your lyrics too much!
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Post by Rob W on Mar 25, 2015 21:00:29 GMT
Has anyone got any feelings on voting this month? Can we vote for our own lyrics but not our own music? Or should we restrict the number of votes to one or two and say that you can't vote for a song that you've been involved in in any way (apart from adding vocals to the end as I have done to my brother's effort! I bet he doesn't use it now!)
Also, I am going away early on 30th. I will upload any songs that are in but the rest will have to be uploaded upon my return (5th/6th April) when I'll also construct the 'Votes and Comments page' on the forum.
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Post by Colin Steward on Mar 25, 2015 21:59:11 GMT
How about if you are the writer of lyrics or music then you shouldn't vote for either song but if you are a guest performer then it's fine to vote, since it's really about songwriting more so than performing.
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Post by eddiecustard on Mar 25, 2015 22:58:36 GMT
I agree with Colin S.
And how about three votes? Or even four?
I've found in recent months that the quality has been high and it's been very difficult to choose who to vote for. After casting my votes I've sometimes woken up in the middle of the night screaming, thinking I've done the wrong thing.
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Post by Rob W on Mar 26, 2015 12:49:48 GMT
I'll ponder the number of available votes question. I have an unwritten rule that says there's a vote for every four songs submitted, so if there are 12 songs we usually have 3 votes. I think given the extra restriction this month (clarified by Colin S - thank you!) we should stick with that rule rather than having more votes. But I'd love to hear from anyone else who has an opinion.
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Post by Rob W on Mar 26, 2015 12:49:53 GMT
I'll ponder the number of available votes question. I have an unwritten rule that says there's a vote for every four songs submitted, so if there are 12 songs we usually have 3 votes. I think given the extra restriction this month (clarified by Colin S - thank you!) we should stick with that rule rather than having more votes. But I'd love to hear from anyone else who has an opinion.
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Post by timwarner on Mar 27, 2015 16:57:20 GMT
Would it be possible to award points rather than just votes? This is especially applicable for Eurovision month. Could we vote for 3 songs giving them 3, 2, and 1, vote? I'm guess I know the answer to this already.
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Post by timwarner on Mar 29, 2015 18:13:44 GMT
Having just submitted my collaboration song, I wondered how viable it would be to send files around to collaborate on stuff without actually meeting?
I did get Rob to do some singing and send him a very short bit with a guide vocal on and he sent me back a file with just his vocal which I dropped into the final track (Rob had no idea what the final track was like, he may not have consented if he'd know). Do we all have the necessary technology to do this and would it be interesting for anyone to collaborate beyond the Elton/Bernie style we did this month? Perhaps one person writes a verse, another the chorus, someone else a riff etc.
Perhaps I'm just trying to get some shared responsibility (or blame) for some of this stuff? Perhaps I'm just over analysing things? I always feel quite vulnerable as I'm about to submit a song.
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